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Is a flight number really unique ?

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  • Is a flight number really unique ?

    Hi,
    example:
    FR24 LH1353 from STR to FRA wrong 24,7,2010
    flightstats LH1353 from STR to FRA wrong 17.7.2010
    correct LH1353 from DUS to PMI 24.7.2010 as DLH03T

    How often the same flight number is used for a different routing ?
    Or is a flight number only valid for one day ?
    http://www.liveatc.net/search/?icao=LSGG

  • #2
    Usually the flight number is valid for a season, summer or winter. I don't have the exact dates but it's up to the airline itself.

    In this case, correct is that LH1353 is a flight from Stuttgart (STR) to Frankfurt (FRA), but this flight has also an alternative callsign that is DLH3T.

    The DUS-PMI flight has flight number LH4406, not LH1353 and alternative callsign DLH03T.

    The problem here is most likely that the database refers to the DLH3T callsign and then it also gets flight LH1353.
    The only one who never makes mistakes is the one who never does anything - Theodore Roosevelt

    Comment


    • #3
      And the callsign is input by the flight crew and its not always changed or correct.
      Mike


      www.radarspotting.com

      Radarspotting since 2005

      Comment


      • #4
        ok, then another example: there seems to be a problem with the database at FR24 or with the callsigns.
        A lot of DLH flights showing Hamburg-Frankfurt.
        radarvirtuel
        Flight Number : DLH7F
        Company : Lufthansa AG
        ICAO Hex Code : 3C4925
        Reg Code : D-ABIE
        Model : Boeing - B737-530
        Departure : CDG - Paris, Charles de Gaulle - France
        (Birds Eye Distance : 314 km - 195 miles)
        Arrival : FRA - Frankfurt, Rhein-Main - Germany
        (Birds Eye Distance : 133 km - 83 miles)

        FR24
        DLH7F
        Callsign: DLH7F
        Flightnr: LH7
        Reg: D-ABIE
        Hex: 3C4925
        Model: Boeing 737-530 (B735)
        Airline: Lufthansa
        Lat: 49.98418
        Lon: 7.70532
        Altitude: 13325 feet (4061 m)
        Ground speed: 373 knots
        (691 km/h / 429 mph)
        Track: 73
        Radar: EDFY
        Squawk:
        From : Hamburg, Hamburg (HAM)
        To: Frankfurt, Main (FRA)
        http://www.liveatc.net/search/?icao=LSGG

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        • #5
          I have no access to the FR24 database and don't know from where it gets its routes.

          I've just tried looking up DLH7F on 5 route websites and none has a result.
          Mike


          www.radarspotting.com

          Radarspotting since 2005

          Comment


          • #6
            Perhaps Mike can have a look.
            DLH55X, DLH62F, DLH11P, DLH27E
            only some examples in southern Europe showing routes in Germany (on RV its ok).
            Understand me right, I would like to help correcting it, not to spam. Its a nice site which should show correct data.
            http://www.liveatc.net/search/?icao=LSGG

            Comment


            • #7
              You're making a useful contribution Charky. And as you say, one for Mike, especially if another site can show the correct routes.
              Mike


              www.radarspotting.com

              Radarspotting since 2005

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Charky View Post
                Perhaps Mike can have a look.
                DLH55X, DLH62F, DLH11P, DLH27E
                only some examples in southern Europe showing routes in Germany (on RV its ok).
                Understand me right, I would like to help correcting it, not to spam. Its a nice site which should show correct data.
                Most of these routes are inserted like this in the database with the correct information, though I believe it's a bug that's displaying wrong information on the radar.
                For example you can see that http://data.flight24.com/flights/lh4138/ has an alternative callsign that is DLH62F though it matches callsign on DLH62 anyway.

                I've inserted DLH7F to the database now, though it will show the flight as DLH7 (HAM-FRA) instead of CDG-FRA untill the bug is fixed.

                You can also search on callsigns here http://data.flight24.com/ for example DLH62F and it will show up as LH4138.
                The only one who never makes mistakes is the one who never does anything - Theodore Roosevelt

                Comment


                • #9
                  Thank you, Albin, for trying to find a solution.
                  regards Karl.
                  http://www.liveatc.net/search/?icao=LSGG

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The problem is just what Albin wrote. We are trying to optimize the php matching code, but it's not so easy with so many different callsigns types. The best solution is to have all routes in database, then it should not match wrong.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      How is the routes database maintained? Updates, corrections and from what primary source?
                      Mike


                      www.radarspotting.com

                      Radarspotting since 2005

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        to Mike, the admin
                        for me that has not a lot to do with calls or flight no.conversion.
                        With the hex you get the registration and with the reg you could jump to flight24 and get the correct latest information (mostly). At least for DLH the data seems to be ok.
                        I expect that the data is coming from there.
                        If it runs not like this please explain.
                        thanks.
                        Last edited by Charky; 2010-07-26, 10:45.
                        http://www.liveatc.net/search/?icao=LSGG

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          charky, can you give an example of what you mean?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Dlh58f d-abiu fr24 muc->ham f24 trf->fra
                            dlh93u d-abxy fr24 cgn->ham f24 bio->fra
                            DLH09Y D-AIBC FR24 BRU->FRA F24 FRA->LIS

                            only in the last 5 minutes. F24 is correct.
                            Last edited by Charky; 2010-07-26, 14:20.
                            http://www.liveatc.net/search/?icao=LSGG

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hi,
                              here another example with more details.
                              If you are looking at DLHflight DLH03X it shows you route HAM->FRA.
                              If you click at the reg D-AIDA at fr24 you are getting the correct info from F24:
                              DLH03X*seen @ 2010-07-27 10:14 CET on route from*MUC*to*BCN
                              if you search manuel on F24 for DLH03X you get
                              LH4474/DLH4474
                              if you search for this (clicking on it and goto) you get the correct route with alternate call DLH03X, but under the map there is shown no flight, because the routine was searching only for the selected flight LH4474/DLH4474.
                              The search routine might need to be extended for the alternate call, but there is no way currently to search for DLH03X directly. You need to go through the "old" call.
                              For what so ever reason FR24 comes up with the flight LH3. Missing leading zero and the last letter. Therefore it matches to the wrong flight LH3 with correct route of flight LH3.
                              Good luck.
                              Last edited by Charky; 2010-07-27, 08:51.
                              http://www.liveatc.net/search/?icao=LSGG

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