Aussie Feeders

[bhaal]

polair 1 and 2 keep them off for rather obvious reasons, that might be tricky in a couple years time, but I envisage exemptions for them as that time nears.

Yeah, have thought about that... Speaking of such things, do the F-18's ever show up? I see the C-17's and C-130's and the wedgetails, MRTT's etc .. but not yet seen any F-18s... Guessing they don't do regular Mode-S...

ohh, do you listen to YCAB traffic? YCAB and YCDR ctafs change Nov 4, going from 118.8 to 125.85, they interfere with Gladstone too much lol

Actually I don't listen to the ATC feeds often... I've just got a couple more RTL-SDR dongles though, so might see how well I can get some of the signals etc..

[bhaal]

Wow!! Finally VH-CXJ (7C0D65) which is a Learjet 45 currently registered to Careflight Queensland has had it's call sign updated.. I cannot find an ownership history for the plane, but it was first registered here in 2001... It's Callsign was AM452 (A Cuba to Mexico route) .. It's call sign now matches it's registration... So, unless it's been out of the country since 2001, then it's taken a little while for someone to notice.... I wonder how they figured it out?

[Ressy]

The problem is, you're running slackware Sometimes I wonder if it's still a thing, I guess it is, I haven't used Slackware since about 1997...

oh its comedian day
damn straight it is, it runs in places youd be surprised hehe

Yep, fully understand, and if you have the hardware running for other stuff then yeah, no point in spinning up a RPi for no reason..

It's also the smaller craft that I like having MLAT capabilities for, things like helicopters and single piston planes, being right near YCAB and YRED, between them and YBAF I see a lot of small craft and helicopters... Including VHNVK and VHPSQ which I always like to watch but can't without MLAT as they rarely turn their ADS-B transponders on... VHPSQ will probably end up always on as it frequently goes above 9000ft .. but VHNVK may not... So yeah. I still see a use for low altitude MLAT

Yeah, theres a few smallies with ads-b, in particular cirrus's, polair 1 and 2 keep them off for rather obvious reasons, that might be tricky in a couple years time, but I envisage exemptions for them as that time nears.

ohh, do you listen to YCAB traffic? YCAB and YCDR ctafs change Nov 4, going from 118.8 to 125.85, they interfere with Gladstone too much lol

[bhaal]

I'm not, I'm running an actual HP server, I dont use debian full stop, our servers run Slackware, the problem is/was

The problem is, you're running slackware Sometimes I wonder if it's still a thing, I guess it is, I haven't used Slackware since about 1997...

only banana here are the ones I scoff down

Yes, this was my bad I have been writing in the MLAT thread as well, and someone there mentioned Bananas ... *tired*

and yeah, i'm hesitant to change the setup as it feeds a couple places, and works well, just not with mlat I spose, which in not too distant future will be less of a problem with mandated requirements to be ads-b capable getting ever closer, 18 months until all IFR a/c in AU airspace must be ads-b equipped, however for WA, thats less then 6 months,m all VFR a/c operating in and around BNE, SYD, MEL and PER getting an upgrade, must be ads-b capable as well, IIRC that's from 2014..

Its probably why we are seeing ATR's and Dash8's being upgraded now, since if they dont upgrade them, those a/c wont be able to fly in/out of 500nm of PER from Feb 4, next year.

Yep, fully understand, and if you have the hardware running for other stuff then yeah, no point in spinning up a RPi for no reason..

It's also the smaller craft that I like having MLAT capabilities for, things like helicopters and single piston planes, being right near YCAB and YRED, between them and YBAF I see a lot of small craft and helicopters... Including VHNVK and VHPSQ which I always like to watch but can't without MLAT as they rarely turn their ADS-B transponders on... VHPSQ will probably end up always on as it frequently goes above 9000ft .. but VHNVK may not... So yeah. I still see a use for low altitude MLAT

[Ressy]

Sorry, I almost didn't understand what you meant for a moment there.. You mean the PiAware package is a .deb ... But in this instance it's built for Raspbian (the Raspberry Pi Debian dist), not Debian per se... What dist are you running on your Banana?

I'm not, I'm running an actual HP server, I dont use debian full stop, our servers run Slackware, the problem is/was the source build calls in and requires debian specific things like dpkg, it demands its version or some crud and other things only found on debian (and maybe its offshoots like ubuntu), so trying to build it on anything else fails, flat out (I briefly looked at the code and it would take considerable time to remove all the debian things, and I''d still have no idea if it would build - not good time management task, so I deleted it and moved on with life

FR24 things are changing indeed.. But I'd say "jumping on the bandwagon" is the more appropriate term.. Presently with FA's MLAT setup I can see MLAT planes down to 1200ft normally (though directly around me I cannot, not enough feeders), even tracked a flight down to 600ft when it landed from the SE end of the short runway at YBBN last night..

If you want me to have a look at your Banana and see if I cannot get PiAware running let me know (the more coverage the better around me)..

only banana here are the ones I scoff down
and yeah, i'm hesitant to change the setup as it feeds a couple places, and works well, just not with mlat I spose, which in not too distant future will be less of a problem with mandated requirements to be ads-b capable getting ever closer, 18 months until all IFR a/c in AU airspace must be ads-b equipped, however for WA, thats less then 6 months,m all VFR a/c operating in and around BNE, SYD, MEL and PER getting an upgrade, must be ads-b capable as well, IIRC that's from 2014..

Its probably why we are seeing ATR's and Dash8's being upgraded now, since if they dont upgrade them, those a/c wont be able to fly in/out of 500nm of PER from Feb 4, next year.

[bhaal]

Presently with FA's MLAT setup I can see MLAT planes down to 1200ft normally (though directly around me I cannot, not enough feeders), even tracked a flight down to 600ft when it landed from the SE end of the short runway at YBBN last night..

I've seen a bunch of MLAT flights tracked via FA's MLAT stuff that just don't appear on FR24.. So I am guessing that FR24's arrogance is really starting to bite the many hands that feed it...

[bhaal]

Indeed, I dont feed PA, since there package requires dpkg package - so its coded for debian only, and I dont have teh time to see what else theyve done to force debian only - there loss!

Sorry, I almost didn't understand what you meant for a moment there.. You mean the PiAware package is a .deb ... But in this instance it's built for Raspbian (the Raspberry Pi Debian dist), not Debian per se... What dist are you running on your Banana?

I believe the source for the FA feeder is on github and probably would compile for the A10 or whatever SoC is on the Banana, but it's time that you probably don't have.. As for "their loss" well, my understanding is the PiAware MLAT stuff is the test bed, basically because it's pretty well known what is running, Pi, dongle, dump1090 ... With nothing exotic or weird CPU requirements .. Once they are happy with MLAT working well based on ADS-B time sync then they will expand it to other platforms as well.. And just wondering.. If you are running Debian (or Ubuntu) on the Banana then there is a good chance it will run the ARMv6 code as well, but I could be wrong with that...

But at FR24 things must be changing, they refused to use anyone but their own f-feeders for mlat data, now they allow rpi's, wonder if its all linux packages - since dedicated servers have much better resource handling than one of them tiny things. but IMO, FR24 have a few things they need to fix before I bother with that, and attitude is one of them, and I aint talking aircraft attitudes lol... I do know mlat setting on dump1090 is active, its always been active for "elsewhere", fr24 have always AFAIK ignored it, so havnt look into their new way. the old software still works and as they say, if it aint ...... dont .... with it

FR24 things are changing indeed.. But I'd say "jumping on the bandwagon" is the more appropriate term.. Presently with FA's MLAT setup I can see MLAT planes down to 1200ft normally (though directly around me I cannot, not enough feeders), even tracked a flight down to 600ft when it landed from the SE end of the short runway at YBBN last night..

If you want me to have a look at your Banana and see if I cannot get PiAware running let me know (the more coverage the better around me)..

[Ressy]

Hahaha, yeah, even the MLAT generated from fr24's F-feeds is very much all over the place...

On the other hand, FA's MLAT which is being done via the PiAware + rtl dongles (by associating mode-s packets received at the same time as ads-b packets across 4 receivers synchronously) is proving to be very accurate, it jumps around maybe 100-300ft at most but most times less, as opposed to fr24's which jumps around 1-2nm at times (or more)... If fr24 bit the bullet and started using the same code base which is part of mutability (assuming the licensing allows them to) then they would have just as many people feeding mode-s and if they also gave us MLAT positions as feedback from the MLAT client just like FA, then there would be a lot of happy campers out there!

As mentioned, I am not participating in fr24 MLAT trials until they change things and I have said that point blank to vinny..

Indeed, I dont feed PA, since there package requires dpkg package - so its coded for debian only, and I dont have teh time to see what else theyve done to force debian only - there loss!

But at FR24 things must be changing, they refused to use anyone but their own f-feeders for mlat data, now they allow rpi's, wonder if its all linux packages - since dedicated servers have much better resource handling than one of them tiny things. but IMO, FR24 have a few things they need to fix before I bother with that, and attitude is one of them, and I aint talking aircraft attitudes lol... I do know mlat setting on dump1090 is active, its always been active for "elsewhere", fr24 have always AFAIK ignored it, so havnt look into their new way. the old software still works and as they say, if it aint ...... dont .... with it

[bhaal]

Yep and you'll soon start to see a lot more of them as they get upgraded to meet pending deadlines.

I gave up on FR24's mlat a long time ago, despite Mike thinking its the bees knees, its far from accurate, so nothing an mlat feed says would surprise me. I'd only question it if its a regular thing, but even then its waste of time, fr24's code system is buggy, they know it despite their denials on many fronts, its why its pointless complaining, as I think you've seen in several topics.

but mlat is ACCURATE, its more accurate then co-ords from true ads-b! I guess fr24 would likely say this pilot's drunk lol

*sigh*

Hahaha, yeah, even the MLAT generated from fr24's F-feeds is very much all over the place...

On the other hand, FA's MLAT which is being done via the PiAware + rtl dongles (by associating mode-s packets received at the same time as ads-b packets across 4 receivers synchronously) is proving to be very accurate, it jumps around maybe 100-300ft at most but most times less, as opposed to fr24's which jumps around 1-2nm at times (or more)... If fr24 bit the bullet and started using the same code base which is part of mutability (assuming the licensing allows them to) then they would have just as many people feeding mode-s and if they also gave us MLAT positions as feedback from the MLAT client just like FA, then there would be a lot of happy campers out there!

As mentioned, I am not participating in fr24 MLAT trials until they change things and I have said that point blank to vinny..

[bhaal]

FVU and VPJ are the only two Virgin ATRs that appear to really have ADS-B. If you use the criteria that an ADS-B equipped plane will show as being detected by a particular FR24 feeder rather than MLAT there are others that appear to have it but don't. Similarly, there are only about 7 or 8 Qantas Dashs that have ADS-B - all of them Q400s - but others, and also some Q300s, have started showing up recently.

If you seeing these in your local radar areas and want to know if they are mode-s or ads-b you could check your own receiver, ie: via dump1090's web interface, or if you use VRS...? All those will tell you if the aircraft has ads-b or not..

[Ressy]

[QUOTE=airnrail;69706]

FVU and VPJ are the only two Virgin ATRs that appear to really have ADS-B. If you use the criteria that an ADS-B equipped plane will show as being detected by a particular FR24 feeder rather than MLAT there are others that appear to have it but don't. Similarly, there are only about 7 or 8 Qantas Dashs that have ADS-B - all of them Q400s - but others, and also some Q300s, have started showing up recently.

Yep and you'll soon start to see a lot more of them as they get upgraded to meet pending deadlines.

I gave up on FR24's mlat a long time ago, despite Mike thinking its the bees knees, its far from accurate, so nothing an mlat feed says would surprise me. I'd only question it if its a regular thing, but even then its waste of time, fr24's code system is buggy, they know it despite their denials on many fronts, its why its pointless complaining, as I think you've seen in several topics.

but mlat is ACCURATE, its more accurate then co-ords from true ads-b! I guess fr24 would likely say this pilot's drunk lol

snapshot2.png

*sigh*

[airnrail]

[QUOTE=Ressy;69672]

??? what call sign, some Virgin ATR's are ADSB equipped, eg: FVU, an ATR-500, is on my screen now

FVU and VPJ are the only two Virgin ATRs that appear to really have ADS-B. If you use the criteria that an ADS-B equipped plane will show as being detected by a particular FR24 feeder rather than MLAT there are others that appear to have it but don't. Similarly, there are only about 7 or 8 Qantas Dashs that have ADS-B - all of them Q400s - but others, and also some Q300s, have started showing up recently.

[Ressy]

[QUOTE=airnrail;69645]

Hmmm ... looks like T-YSSY51 and/or FR24 may be having some issues possibly, tonight ...

It is reporting SSM1 (7CF7CA) with wierd altitudes, no squawk code, varying speeds etc - I'm seeing it as its normal rock steady self. Usually the SSMs don't show on the map.

T-YSSY51 is one of several that of late appears to be supplying both ADS-B and M-LAT data for the same aircraft. It also sometimes shows non-ADS-B equipped Virgin ATRs and Qantaslink Dashs as T-YSSY51 rather than MLATx. There has been some previous discussion in this very thread, particularly from poster bhaal who operates T-YBBN50 near Brisbane.

??? what call sign, some Virgin ATR's are ADSB equipped, eg: FVU, an ATR-500, is on my screen now

[bhaal]

T-YSSY51 is one of several that of late appears to be supplying both ADS-B and M-LAT data for the same aircraft. It also sometimes shows non-ADS-B equipped Virgin ATRs and Qantaslink Dashs as T-YSSY51 rather than MLATx. There has been some previous discussion in this very thread, particularly from poster bhaal who operates T-YBBN50 near Brisbane.

Only in hope it draws attention from the right people to hopefully get the problem sorted, it's such an easy mistake to make as there is very little that documents what not to do... As well as dump1090-mutability (or the FA version which is more less thje same) not quite working properly, its not suppose to forward the MLAT data unless specifically told to, but apparently it still does.. (I think I mentioned that before as well)...

airnrail: or are you implying I should be less vocal about this issue?

[airnrail]

Hi everyone, another newbie here. T-YTEM1. I've got a basic rig set up here with a roof-mounted homebrew co-co with a stick-pc doing the decode. Getting pretty decent range out of it (236nm), without any amps or anything of the sort.
I'm expecting that I'll rarely be seen as the capturing radar, as I'm a bit swamped with nearby F- feeders, but as I type this, I've managed to get a C172 tracked in my name!

Been keeping an eye out for you and spotted this one this afternoon. Don't know what the plane is - a warbird from the museum at Temora perhaps? Cheers.temora1.jpg