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Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China - Flight MH370

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  • Originally posted by mcjensen View Post
    Is it possible that the Captain pilot pre-programmed all of the planes flight plans into the flight computer before takeoff, after specific training on his simulator, including every change of direction and altitude change? Calculating exactly where the plane would end up with the permitted fuel?
    Then the only real thing he had to focus on was eliminating the co-pilot( i.e. locking him out of the cabin), and somehow knocking out the passengers in the other part of the plane. Can it be done with relative ease?
    Obviously, this particular scenario is a suicide mission with total destruction of the plane and the passengers.
    The confusing part here is,… that, though the passengers may be new and unknown to each other, but the pilot staff with the hostesses and his crew members,..etc. is like a family members and known to each other. So, if one guy locks the cockpit from inside, denies to open,… and these others people, notice sharp turns and high altitudes changes, the other 13+ staff knows immediately that he got crazy, out of his mind and to a suicidal attempt, and even hostesses themselves will get their cells out and start calling ATC / related their hostess staff department, also asking the passengers too, to dial certain numbers immediately if anyone could,… and get me the line immediately,.. etc.

    But to some extent this case seems like,.. say fraud – if one hostess added something in a drink to the pilot ( poison/sleeping tabs ),… or could also be the peeled off of door/roof or certain plain cover and getting all frost and cold in, ( someone said on TV, -16 degree F , that’s a murder ) and hence all guys got half fainted and then,...
    let auto-pilot do the job, so far the flight went. ( <-- rare possibilty though, since certain switching off, of the commu. is done manually )
    Last edited by voyager10; 2014-03-22, 15:10.

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    • Originally posted by voyager10 View Post
      even hostesses themselves will get their cells out and start calling ATC / related their hostess staff department, also asking the passengers too, to dial certain numbers immediately if anyone could,… and get me the line immediately,.. etc.
      It should be possible for investigators to get the IMEI numbers of all the cell phones of everyone on board. No matter which route it took there should be a trace at least one of them being on and pinging a cell tower - no matter how faint the signal or which route was taken. To get out to the ocean they had to go over populated areas first (like Indonesia). That may at least help confirm a direction. The latest Chinese satellite image definitely looks like an real object, whereas most of the Tomnod stuff could very well be large wave crests. I also assume the Chinese (assuming Spy) satellite records light in the non-visible portion of the spectrum as well (IR and UV)....which would make it easier to separate objects from water...

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      • Originally posted by voyager10 View Post
        Originally Posted by Speed Daemon View Post
        Interesting. The Telegraph article that you included is proof positive that if someone wants to find something significant enough, that anything will do.

        In the spirit of the Telegraph article, I found some "odd features" of my own:

        The tower needlessly identified itself "this is KL control tower..." which is sort of like a man in a Captain's uniform with a name tag reading "Obvious" declaring "I am Captain Obvious!" Yes, we can see that ourselves, Captain Obvious.


        Probably it's a needed and used to habit,.... and since the plane can talk to the tower of KL, reaching tower of Vietnaam ( confirming of thier arrival and runway ready,.. etc. ) and even beijjing,.. so just to verify the conversation, that " 'here you are talking to, right now' " - perhaps a usual way of speaking.

        At 12:40 in the morning, the tower says "good night", even though it previously had said "good morning".

        MH370 says "goodbye" to the tower. Proof positive that they never intended to return!

        In their last transmission at 1:29AM, MH370 says "good night", even though it previously had said "good morning".

        That's significant...if you want it to be...

        Especially, the plane is in air, and traveling towards East at 12.00 around night time,
        night/morning confusion will always remain,... for the receiving and leaving country versus the plane pilots,...
        also towards the east, further you travel, the time is 'earlier/ahead' .
        I thought Speed Daemon was only being sarcastic....
        Last edited by Mac Attack; 2014-03-22, 15:26.

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        • Originally posted by ajrystad View Post
          One reason - the transponder malfunctions, starts squawking garbage and clutters up ATC with bogus data. Not good. On/Off selector switch in the cockpit makes sense.

          This is the first time to my knowledge that a transponder has been turned off in flight so that someone could steal a commercial aircraft. To suggest that "we" need to take away the ability to turn off a piece of equipment is premature at this juncture. Maybe if air crews start stealing aircraft left and right, or they let unauthorized personnel onto the flight desk who then hijack the plane, then "we" institute the "always track me" tech. The good old days of the standard hijack for whatever are 13 years gone. Now we worry about Boeing / Airbus Cruise Missiles. But in the time since 9/11/01, how many times has a plane been "re-purposed" in flight? It's an anomaly, provided the flight crew keep the dang door shut. Now if the Captain or Co-Pilot decide to divert from the scheduled flight plan, there is no real way to mitigate that scenario. We trust them, but they're human, just like the rest of us.

          A.J.
          F-KBOI2

          I am guessing that you are balancing "need to action" vs "probability/frequency of re-occurrence". To me, one incident with 237 lives on board is once too many. Granted, we can never make things 100% risk free and be cost effective. Do keep in mind that I am not trying to mitigate risk of human wrong doing (never possible). What I am trying to mitigate is the risk of not knowing where a multi-million dollar plane (plus the value of its passengers' and crews' lives) is for a much extended period of time.

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          • Malaysia has clarified that the object found by China is 22.5m by 13m, not 22m by 30m.

            Its transport ministry says it received the information by phone during the press conference and was misheard,

            http://pzy.be/i/2/1LJba47.png ( do not click -- copy-paste in new url and refresh twice )

            Chinese news agency Xinhua has given a little more detail on today's latest development.

            They say the satellite picture of the 22.5m long and 13m wide object was taken in the southern Indian Ocean nu earth observation satellite Gaofen-1 at around 12am on Tuesday March 18, Beijing time.

            It was spotted at 44 degrees, 57 minutes south latitude, and 90 degrees, 13 minutes east longitude - around 120k south west of the object seen by Australia.


            China Satellite Image
            http://pzy.be/i/2/china_satellite_image_mh370.jpg ( do not click -- copy-paste in new url and refresh twice )

            But have u noticed again the same problem as the Australian satellite images...???

            They say the satellite picture of the 22.5m long and 13m wide object was taken in the southern Indian Ocean nu earth observation satellite Gaofen-1 at around 12am on Tuesday March 18, Beijing time.

            This image is of March 18. Today it is March 22....Four days have passed....Will they again say that now the debris might have drifted or sunk.
            The Australians gave the image after 5 days and said the same thing.

            Does it take four days to process satellite image and release it to the world?????

            http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-26697048

            Honestly speaking, anything found floating on the surface will be more reliable, since at the ocean-bottom, you will find and locate tons of such junks, ( unless its shows its proper shape too ) since thousands of boats and steamers has gone down since the civilization started and also during every space attempt, the empty fuel tanks falls into the ocean, and no one would ( I guess ) gets it out.
            Last edited by voyager10; 2014-03-22, 16:21.

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            • Originally posted by Mac Attack View Post
              I thought Speed Daemon was only being sarcastic....
              Me too.............

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              • ^^ . Prol'y, I missed the wit in it.
                --
                Could it be, that the plane was filled with fireless smokes/fumes of the batteries and hence all got unconscious ?

                There were 20 around passenger seats, intentionally ( kept blank ) kept vacated perhaps to offset for the cargo weight,
                and after a lot hiding,... what they were transporting,..
                now they say it was lithium batteries,..Electrical fire releasing toxic fumes but no flames, perhaps? One of those important details experts will have to clarify.

                I meant fire burns also plane wiring, which is needed to keep the plane in the air (fly-by-wire). Besides that, high temperature fire could melt (or weaken) alluminium-based alloys which the plane is made of.

                The cargo bay was filled with lithium-ion batteries.

                Batteries. Electrical fire. Need to shut down ACARS and all electrical systems. Climbing up to dampen the fire. Diversion to nearest airport. Smoke onboard, everybody choking. Zombie plane wandering in a straight line under autopilot. Fuel tank dry. Crash in the ocean.


                To me, it's very much a case closed. A lot of details to uncover, still.

                No UFO, no pilot suicide, no terrorism, no landing on Dr No's island, no black hole, nothing. 24hrs news channels are driving us crazy.

                Sad story, all my prayers to the families, sincerely hope they find the peace of the mind and of the heart.
                Last edited by voyager10; 2014-03-22, 16:27.

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                • Raja Dalelah: I'm convinced I saw aircraft near Andaman islands



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                  • Originally posted by Mac Attack View Post
                    Did not check into this forum for 12+ hours and suddenly it became a tomnod support site.... with people seemingly "yelling at each other" (albeit the texts were not capitalised / bolded) and claiming of leaving....
                    Same here. I found that using the "ignore" function handily removed all of the Tomnod followers from my sight. Much better now!
                    Last edited by speedbird1960; 2014-03-22, 18:48. Reason: Tomnod please

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                    • Originally posted by Exadios View Post
                      The report of 45,000 feet appeared in the NYT. Apparently the transponder went off and this was followed by a climb to 45,000 feet. This report only lasted a day or two. It was followed by a report in the NYT that, after the transponder went off, the plane executed a turn to the west "under computer control" (at 35,000 feet). Go figure!
                      And without the transponder to give the altitude data to local authorities or FR24, that begs the question "how did they know the altitude data?" Did they ever know the altitude data at that point? If they did, precisely how did they get it?

                      IIRC the Malaysian authorities were saying a lot of crazy things at that time -- things that they later backtracked on, or dropped altogether. If they aren't confirming or denying the point today, I put it in the "likely BS" bin.

                      It should go without saying that second hand reports coming from "the news" are not the stuff that makes independent confirmation. Two wrongs don't make a right.

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                      • Originally posted by Exadios View Post
                        Circuit breakers exist for a very good safety reason. If the answer is to install electronics onto airliners in an unsafe manner then what is the question?
                        Hear, hear!

                        The #1 priority should always be prevention above all else. Disobeying basic safety rules (and perhaps causing more emergencies) in the name of giving a small number of people the timely information that they crave is lunacy.

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                        • Originally posted by cartmell100 View Post
                          Not sure if anyone has raised this earlier but - why would the facility to switch off the transponder be in the cockpit?
                          There are times when the transponder replies can cause unnecessary confusion to radar operators. Typically transponders are only in use when an aircraft is about to fly and during flight. Keeping transponders turned off when not flying contributes to overall flight safety.

                          It should be noted that transponders were never intended to be used as Big Brother-style tattletales. The best plan still is to limit flight deck access to trusted people.

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                          • Originally posted by Speed Daemon View Post
                            I found that using the "ignore" function handily removed all of the Tomnod followers from my sight. Much better now!
                            There hasn't been a tomnod post for a whole day. Until you brought it up again :-/
                            Last edited by speedbird1960; 2014-03-22, 18:51. Reason: Quote edited to Tomnod.

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                            • Originally posted by Originally Posted by Mac Attack View Post
                              Did not check into this forum for 12+ hours and suddenly it became a tomnod support site.... with people seemingly "yelling at each other" (albeit the texts were not capitalised / bolded) and claiming of leaving....

                              Speed Daemon;48364
                              Same here. I found that using the "ignore" function handily removed all of the Tomnod followers from my sight. Much better now!
                              You guys have only joined yourselves since mh370 disappeared, and I've seen much more rudeness from you than from people posting tomnod pictures. Shame on you. I realise you might not even see this post if I'm one of the "tomnods".

                              My bet is that most of us were already fr24 fans and, like others have said, came here because we knew that the fr24 might have more thoughtful and accurate analysis than the general fora found on news sites etc.

                              We all desperately want to see mh370 found and we are getting our heads round the puzzle in different ways. As I said earlier on, I don't know why tomnod discussion should be excluded - it's the only actually productive thing we can do. Why it it any less deserving than endless speculation about what may have happened. And, this thread is within the general aviation board so surely it permits digression from pure fr24 discussion?

                              How about a separate thread for tomnod sightings discussion, if that's ok with the mods of course? If not then we could pin a post to somewhere able to handle the traffic. But please, fellow users, don't show such hostilty here. I'm sure that all of us have the loved ones of the passengers in our minds. We all care about this. So let's be a little kinder to each other.
                              Last edited by speedbird1960; 2014-03-22, 18:54. Reason: Tomnod word edit.

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                              • Originally posted by deijnoff View Post
                                Oh, ok! learned something new then. Allthough on BBC they said that it is possible to re-route all the Power, including the flight data recorder, or is that a different thing? Maybe they got it wrong or something
                                The B777 has a sophisticated power management system (ELMS), two AC and two DC power busses.

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