Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China - Flight MH370

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by zed View Post
    Has any authority come out and detailed why the plane rose to 45'000 feet?
    As far as I know nobody other than the NYT have detailed that it did climb to 45,000 feet. Why it would do so is a matter for conjecture.

    Comment


    • If it was computer "hacking", the hacker picked the worst possible target! The 777 uses 3 different computer systems. Not just 3 redundant computers -- 3 totally different types of computer! On top of that they use 3 different types of compiler. 99.9% of the code is written in Ada, which is used mostly by the military. If the rogue code on each and every one of the 3 computers didn't sync up perfectly, alarms would sound!

      The amount of work needed to simultaneously fly the plane in the wrong direction and show the pilots convincing but wrong flight information is a gigantic project. Let's say they did; it was night after all. What about the transponder? And the radios? Those aren't hackable like the FMC is. After trying unsuccessfully to raise the Vietnam ATC for a half-hour, I'd be making calls on all of my radios, from HF to VHF to satcom. We know that the satcom radio was working, so that would be the end of the line for the hacker.

      BTW, as I mentioned before, the B777 can completely bypass the digital fly-by-wire system, and the pilots can hand fly the plane. A hacked flight control system might fool the flight crew for a while, but not before they could radio for help, regain control and fly to safety.

      Comment


      • Hi, first time poster here. I've been following a long time.
        Interesting but scary article

        Comment


        • Originally posted by moof View Post
          Hi, first time poster here. I've been following a long time.
          Interesting but scary article
          I would be very surprised if the US, PRC, France and India have not been searching all possible landing strips for at least a week. (The PRC and India must consider themselves as prime targets.) The Malaysians, and possibly the Indians, where obviously asleep at the switch which allowed the aircraft evade the air defense system. But I doubt whether that will happen when it takes off again.

          The plane was reported to have an endurance of 8 hours - but that's at 35,000 feet. At 5,000 feet that figure would be almost half that which would place any possible landing strip much closer to Malaysia. If the flight was four hours duration than this implies that the pilots had a good understanding of the true mechanics of the satellite link and left the transceiver on for eight hours as a decoy. This would be quite surprising. For instance I did not know that the beam steering was recorded but they must have known this.

          Comment


          • Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68 (another 777)?
            http://keithledgerwood.tumblr.com/po...ar-using-sia68 more fuel on the fire...

            Comment


            • I see... Thanx!

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Jarod View Post
                Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68 (another 777)?
                http://keithledgerwood.tumblr.com/po...ar-using-sia68 more fuel on the fire...
                Such a scenario may have fooled the civil radar system but I do not think it would work against the air defense system - especially upon later review.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Exadios View Post
                  I don't think any nation can allow unidentified aircraft to wander around in their airspace at 500 knots.
                  Why not? There aren't speed limits in the sky. When it comes to many so-called "developing" nations, they might not have much say in the matter. According to this article, many southeast Asian nations don't even switch their military radar on much of the time. And civil aviation authorities don't have interceptor planes, so the most they can do is shout "get off my lawn" into the radio. What's worse, if a civil radar operator sees a plane flying at airliner altitudes and speeds, he or she will likely conclude that it's an airliner, transponder or not, and do nothing.


                  It is not true that radar needs to be aimed. All modern military radar is implemented using a phased array
                  Sorry but you're in error. If you watched the coverage of the Olympic games in Sochi, Russia recently, you would have seen quite a few Soviet era military radar antennas using parabolic reflectors. (I'm guessing with 20/20 hindsight that their newest gear was farther up the coast near the Ukraine.)

                  While phased array can save on some moving parts, the same basic laws of nature still apply. The only way to know that a plane is at 45,000 feet without the help of the plane's transponder is to point a very narrow radar beam in the plane's direction, and measure the return signal strength at different elevations. Whether it's steered mechanically or electronically, measuring altitude requires that azimuth element. There's no way around it...except with a transponder.

                  Comment


                  • Latest update from the Aviation Herald:

                    "On Mar 17th 2014 Malaysia's Minister of Transport reported that three investigators of the French BEA, who had been involved in the search for AF-447 see Crash: Air France A332 over Atlantic on Jun 1st 2009, aircraft entered high altitude stall and impacted ocean, have arrived in Malaysia and are joining the search for MH-370 sharing their knowledge and experience with AF-447. Police had visited the homes of both pilots on Mar 9th 2014 and spoken with family members, one Mar 15th the captain's flight simulator was disassembled with the help of family members and re-assembled at police premises for further investigation. The last ACARS transmission received was at 01:07L, the next regular ACARS transmission would have occurred at 01:37L 30 minutes later. It is not known when the ACARS system was disabled. Initial investigation identified the first officer was transmitting the last radio call.

                    On Mar 17th 2014 Australia announced that they are dedicated substantial forces to coordinate and conduct the search in the sectors of the South Indian Ocean. All Australian agencies are reviewing their data to see whether anything can be determined that might help to locate the aircraft."

                    http://avherald.com/h?article=4710c69b&opt=0
                    AMS Daily Fight Information: http://schiphol.dutchplanespotters.nl/

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Speed Daemon View Post
                      Why not? There aren't speed limits in the sky. When it comes to many so-called "developing" nations, they might not have much say in the matter. According to this article, many southeast Asian nations don't even switch their military radar on much of the time. And civil aviation authorities don't have interceptor planes, so the most they can do is shout "get off my lawn" into the radio. What's worse, if a civil radar operator sees a plane flying at airliner altitudes and speeds, he or she will likely conclude that it's an airliner, transponder or not, and do nothing.



                      Sorry but you're in error. If you watched the coverage of the Olympic games in Sochi, Russia recently, you would have seen quite a few Soviet era military radar antennas using parabolic reflectors. (I'm guessing with 20/20 hindsight that their newest gear was farther up the coast near the Ukraine.)

                      While phased array can save on some moving parts, the same basic laws of nature still apply. The only way to know that a plane is at 45,000 feet without the help of the plane's transponder is to point a very narrow radar beam in the plane's direction, and measure the return signal strength at different elevations. Whether it's steered mechanically or electronically, measuring altitude requires that azimuth element. There's no way around it...except with a transponder.
                      The last time I saw those height finders was in the 1980s in the ME. Are you sure you were not looking at photos of a museum?

                      The article would explain why the plane was not picked up. As I said before the idea that anybody could think that an aircraft doing 500 knots with its transponder off was somebody else's problem in the post 9/11 world astounds me. Did these people not get the memo?

                      Phased array radars can track a number of targets simultaneously. The transmitter beam switches very rapidly.
                      Last edited by Exadios; 2014-03-17, 10:31.

                      Comment


                      • Has anyone been able to see the unidentified 777 near the Himalayas that someone mentioned like 10 pages back?

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by eshwe View Post
                          Has anyone been able to see the unidentified 777 near the Himalayas that someone mentioned like 10 pages back?
                          I spent half an hour looking at Playback and found nothing.
                          AMS Daily Fight Information: http://schiphol.dutchplanespotters.nl/

                          Comment


                          • I am watching a flight of a 757 norwind air from pakistan looks like its heading to Kabul, afganistan. It has no call sign and it left from the desert in southern pakistan no airfield i can see just desert how precise is flightradar on location?
                            its actually gone past kabul and heading for mazari sharif
                            Last edited by robear; 2014-03-17, 10:46.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Jarod View Post
                              Did Malaysian Airlines 370 disappear using SIA68 (another 777)?
                              http://keithledgerwood.tumblr.com/po...ar-using-sia68 more fuel on the fire...
                              That's interesting information! However if we choose to obey the teachings of William of Ockham and go for the explanation with the least conjecture, we must conclude that the radar return at that place and time is most likely to be the lone SIA68 flight.

                              The story from Malaysian government officials about that radar contact near Penang have changed several times. The first report specifically called it "secondary radar", which means that it was a transponder reply. But the MH370's transponders were reported to be turned off then! Later revisions claim that the missing plane's transponder was turned off while simultaneously insisting that the now unidentified blip was the missing plane for sure. Clearly without any transponder data, no such determination can be made!

                              The most reasonable explanation was that the general was telling the truth about it being a transponder return. Probably the military radar facility lacked the capacity to decode civilian modes, and so there is no proof what plane it was. Much ado about nothing. But if other sources place a known 777 over Penang exactly when and where the military radar made contact, the most reasonable answer now is that it was SIA68 all by its lonesome, and that the Prime Minister was lying...again.

                              So on one hand there's an airliner precisely where it was supposed to be. On the other there's a wild tale of the missing plane escaping radar contact until it magically appears smack dab in the wake turbulence of another heavy plane, but miraculously it manages to fly close enough to make the two planes appear as one. And the air defense radar system which was designed to identify individual fighter planes flying in close formation miraculously failed to perform one of its most basic functions. Hmmm... Thanks Mr. Ockham, I'll believe the first one!

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by robear View Post
                                I am watching a flight of a 757 norwind air from pakistan looks like its heading to Kabul, afganistan. It has no call sign and it left from the desert in southern pakistan no airfield i can see just desert how precise is flightradar on location?
                                its actually gone past kabul and heading for mazari sharif
                                The track may appear to start where the plane has enough elevation to be received. Project the track back and you may see an air strip.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X