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Malaysia Airlines Flight Goes Missing En Route to China - Flight MH370

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  • Originally posted by speedbird1960 View Post
    Its not just about saving lives, its the families of the loved ones not knowing where the Aircraft is, also if an Aircraft is found quicker it cuts down on resources looking for it and the chances of losing valuable data and evidence.

    In my opinion the location of a Commercial Airliner should always be known even if it has disappeared of the Radar.
    The matter of families knowing were a crashed aircraft is a political problem. And, I suspect, Malaysian Airlines will respond to this political problem by transmitting more position reports in the ACARS stream. However, politics should not cause us to adopt unsafe aircraft designs as has been suggested in this forum.

    Increased position reporting just puts back to AF 447. The wreckage was not found until 2 years after the crash - although much of that time was wasted. So I do not see it as the solution that you do.

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    • Originally posted by speedbird1960 View Post
      Its not just about saving lives, its the families of the loved ones not knowing where the Aircraft is, also if an Aircraft is found quicker it cuts down on resources looking for it and the chances of losing valuable data and evidence.

      In my opinion the location of a Commercial Airliner should always be known even if it has disappeared of the Radar.
      If we look at the overall cost of this search operation, the planes, ships, manpower utilised, all of this would have been saved if the aircraft had constantly been automatically reporting its position. When we look at the money countries expend on defence, radar systems, satellite systems, fighter interceptors, the arguments against such a device become trivial.

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      • Originally posted by anterian View Post
        If we look at the overall cost of this search operation, the planes, ships, manpower utilised, all of this would have been saved if the aircraft had constantly been automatically reporting its position. When we look at the money countries expend on defence, radar systems, satellite systems, fighter interceptors, the arguments against such a device become trivial.
        The question that remains is what would such a system have done to change anything in this instance? That is how would such a system improved the resilience against a single point failure?

        You seem to think only in terms of money. The real issue is the engineering and safety.

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        • Originally posted by Exadios View Post
          The question that remains is what would such a system have done to change anything in this instance? That is how would such a system improved the resilience against a single point failure?

          You seem to think only in terms of money. The real issue is the engineering and safety.
          No I am not thinking in terms of money other than countering the argument that such an upgrade would be too expensive by looking at the savings such an upgrade would create.
          If we look at modern cars they have ABS, SIP, airbags, would drivers and passengers prefer not to have them if the car was then cheaper to buy? A marketable safety device needs the customer's willingness to pay for it, in a passenger plane the ultimate customer is the passenger not the airline.

          As to, "what would such a system have done to change anything in this instance?" The fact that quite large (75 foot) pieces of debris have been detected raises the possibility there may have been initial survivors, after 2 weeks these will have succumbed to dehydration.

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          • From the upgrade point of view you have not specified which system you are referring to. Are you talking about scars? Or is there some other system? If the latter explain how it would have made a difference. That is supply the data that you have on the resilience to a single point failure.

            With regards to survivors I can only assume that you are joking.

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            • At the end of the day,...Life is the most precious thing and No compromise should ever be invited or appreciated in that arena,.....n' any precaution for the safety and well-being of the we human-beings/passengers is needed, IS needed,...and one must take it, without any doubt.
              IMHO, It’s time to switch to the GPS plane locater system leaving the radars aside,..
              Any flying plane, should be and must be under your eye-vision for every second, and should never go out of any audio and video communication.
              No switches should be ever ever provided to play/turn off with such aspects,..unless the 'act of God' does it,...


              Other than that, we have even seen the videos of quick-fix repairing the 'plane wing' even with a ‘duct tape’, in just a matter of seconds,….. and let it go !

              And, the sorry part is,...we all know what would be the results, next !
              Last edited by voyager10; 2014-03-27, 04:15.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Exadios View Post
                From the upgrade point of view you have not specified which system you are referring to. Are you talking about scars? Or is there some other system? If the latter explain how it would have made a difference. That is supply the data that you have on the resilience to a single point failure.

                With regards to survivors I can only assume that you are joking.
                We seem to be talking about two different issues, obviously knowing the location of a crash does not prevent the crash but it saves time, effort and money in locating the crash. As there have been several suggested upgrades with various degrees of reliability (resilience), that is a separate issue, an issue for discussion by governments, airlines, engineers and passengers.
                With regards to survivors, I am not joking, analysis of previous crashes shows that more a passenger is surrounded by intact debris the greater are the chances of their survival, particularly if small or young.

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                • Originally posted by voyager10 View Post
                  At the end of the day,...Life is the most precious thing and No compromise should ever be invited or appreciated in that arena,.....n' any precaution for the safety and well-being of the we human-beings/passengers is needed, IS needed,...and one must take it, without any doubt.
                  IMHO, It’s time to switch to the GPS plane locater system leaving the radars aside,..
                  Any flying plane, should be and must be under your eye-vision for every second, and should never go out of any audio and video communication.
                  No switches should be ever ever provided to play/turn off with such aspects,..unless the 'act of God' does it,...


                  Other than that, we have even seen the videos of quick-fix repairing the 'plane wing' even with a ‘duct tape’, in just a matter of seconds,….. and let it go !

                  And, the sorry part is,...we all know what would be the results, next !
                  "At the end of the day,...Life is the most precious thing ", unfortunately this is not so, the original Fire Brigades were created not to save lives but to protect property and the first fire brigades were formed by insurance companies. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_firefighting

                  To the mods, this may seem a digression but I am trying to show that money is always an important factor in any safety implementation.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by anterian View Post
                    We seem to be talking about two different issues, obviously knowing the location of a crash does not prevent the crash but it saves time, effort and money in locating the crash. As there have been several suggested upgrades with various degrees of reliability (resilience), that is a separate issue, an issue for discussion by governments, airlines, engineers and passengers.
                    With regards to survivors, I am not joking, analysis of previous crashes shows that more a passenger is surrounded by intact debris the greater are the chances of their survival, particularly if small or young.
                    Again, rather than focusing on flight safety, you are focusing on the convenience of the recovery operation.

                    Please post the studies to which you are referring to.

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                    • Anterian:

                      ^^ Well,...I will cut this diversion short, with few more added lines,..

                      Yaah,.. unfortunately, that's the sad event and sorry fact of the life. In US, we also had a big news on the same event, ( a year+ ago ) that a house was burning to a deadly fire
                      and only 30 feet away standing a well-equipped fire brigade with its crew were just enjoying watching it,...were not doing anything about it,..
                      and their reasoning was, because the guy had intentionally removed the fire insurance on his property, and hence it was out of their look out and duty,...
                      .....And indirectly, the "humanity" itself the people saw it burning !

                      And, here are the state of the art tech. guys, who repaired the plane in just 5 sec with duct tapes,..



                      Click for videos !
                      Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.

                      I was watching the passenger boarding bridge retract, as the lower left corner of the bridge got closer and closer and closer to the engine, I started to won...

                      The engine of the airplane is repaired with duct tape, some people call it speed tape. It's a piece of tape stuck to the outside of the engine cowling.
                      Last edited by voyager10; 2014-03-27, 04:40.

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                      • Airbus A319-115(LR) VH-VHD returning.

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                        • MH 370 Victims' Photos:


                          press-1

                          press-2


                          ..

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                          • Originally posted by Exadios View Post
                            Airbus A319-115(LR) VH-VHD returning.
                            Canadair CL604 Challenger VH-OCV returning. And Bombardier Global 6000 VH-TGG returning.

                            Looks like they're all returning early today. Weather is reported to be taking a turn for the worse this evening.
                            Last edited by Exadios; 2014-03-27, 06:25.

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                            • Originally posted by Exadios View Post
                              Again, rather than focusing on flight safety, you are focusing on the convenience of the recovery operation.

                              Please post the studies to which you are referring to.
                              Please post the studies... a polite way of saying "I don't believe you"
                              Well someone did just that in this thread many days ago, a search with Google will also give you much data and information. However you can even generate your own data, a typical human body in free fall reaches a terminal velocity of 120 mph, the limiting factor being drag. Now if you are attached to something like a seat and which has a lower density than your body, drag will increase in relationship to your combined mass and terminal velocity will become lower.

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                              • Exadios:

                                ^ I read somewhere, that the very area was to hit by the cyclone Giligan,..!!
                                too bad, that the planes have to come back home all the way far back, daily.
                                Hope, the U S military base at Diego Garcia, had rather provided a shelter for them,... which is right there situated,...

                                Unmanned submarine will be used for searching...
                                After weeks of searching high above the ocean, the key to solving the mystery behind Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 may now lie deep underwater. At the Woods H...

                                Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.
                                Last edited by voyager10; 2014-03-27, 06:53.

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